Real Jews for the AZCowboy.
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AuthorTopic: Real Jews for the AZCowboy.
topic by
Lynette
4/3/2002 (6:08)
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How Many Lives?
Talk presented by Rabbi Dovid Weiss of Neturei Karta Int. at the “Evening for Peace with Justice for the Palestinian & Iraqi People”, in the Cooper Union Great Hall, New York City , on February 23, 2002 . Hosted by the International A.N.S.W.E.R. (Act New to Stop War & End Racism)



With G-d’s help, may my words find favor in His eyes and increase the Glory of Heaven.

A popular song of some decades past, asked the question, “How many deaths will it take till we know that too many people have died?’

Judging by recent events in the Holy Land , indeed, judging by the ongoing events of the last century, the answer is “More than anyone could ever imagine.”

There is an image that is sadly fading from human consciousness. It is the picture of the Torah Jew, steadfast in his loyalty to the Creator and His Torah, moral and humble in his dealings with all men. His integrity is impeccable and his sense of empathy encompasses all mankind.

We believe that it is this Jew, following the dictates of Sinai, whose life is a sanctification of the Divine Name and who will ultimately figure prominently in the ushering of the Messianic utopia, of peace and brotherhood among all men, solely through his Divine worship.

Zionism and the Zionist State , is a massive rejection of this holy image.

By seeking to end Jewish exile by this - worldly means, it denies the Divine source of our exile and final redemption and is expressly and totally forbidden by the Torah.

At root it is denial of the spiritual essence of Jewish history.

The vast majority of Zionism’s early ideologues and supporters, were almost uniformly recruited from the Torah ignorant elements of eastern European society.

Would time and format permit, we could spend much time analyzing the philosophy and history of the Zionist movement. Suffice it to say, that it has always evoked passionate opposition, from throughout the ranks of Orthodox Jewry.

Now, please keep in mind, that one should not confuse the deep love and reverence for the Holy Land itself, with the Zionist movement,. The movement sought to seize political sovereignty from the land’s inhabitants, by driving out many of them and subjecting those that stayed to persecution and second class citizenship. This again, is a terrible sin and crime, expressly and totally forbidden by the Torah.

Conversely Torah Jews have always loved the Land but never sought to rule it politically.

Over the centuries, many pious souls settled there. And, this is a most important point, those pious Jewish souls were never persecuted by their Islamic, Palestinian neighbors. They lived side by side, baby sat each other’s children and were both persecuted by assorted foreign powers.

This peaceful existence was shattered when the Zionist immigration began and sought to deprive the indigenous people of their basic dignity as human beings.

Following the Second World War, the suffering of the Jewish people led many nations to erroneously conclude, that Zionist sovereignty over the Holy Land would help alleviate anti-Semitism, by creating a “safe haven” for the wandering Jew.

The decision to create the Israeli state, has over the past half century led to a seemingly endless river of bloodshed. Palestinians and Jews have died and continue to die. Instead of alleviating anti-Semitism and the Jewish suffering, they have only exacerbated it both in Palestine and throughout the world.

Let us be clear about the source of the suffering of both Palestinian and Jewish people. It is the Zionist insistence on the dispossession of the Palestinian people.

The only Torah sanctioned and moral solution to this problem; the only solution sure to yield peace, is to return sovereignty over the entire Holy Land to the Palestinian people. This would of course obviously include returning Al-Aksa, Jerusalem , the right of return and adequate compensation thereof, to the Palestinian individuals who so desire.

This, would finally end the suffering of the Palestinian people.

And, as far as Jewry is concerned, it would allow us to return to our Divine calling, of Torah observance, prayer, kindness and study. We would once again be able to pursue our Torah centered lives, to serve as a source of inspiration and consolation to all men.

The Jewish people are required to be loyal citizens is every country wherein they reside, whether it is us in the United States , or our brethren in Iran , or our brethren in Palestine . In Palestine , the Jewish people must be loyal to the indigenous Palestinian populace.

The Jewish people were not made to act as persecutors of the Other. They are to be a “kingdom of priests” ministering to the physical and spiritual needs of suffering mankind.

Zionism’s end, will be the first step towards Jewish rebirth.

A rebirth, which will hopefully be the first phase in the Messianic redemption of all mankind, in brotherhood, where we all will recognize the One G-d and serve Him in peace, speedily in our days. – Amen
reply by
JC
4/3/2002 (9:28)
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The Hard Truth
By THOMAS L. FRIEDMAN

A terrible disaster is in the making in the Middle East. What Osama bin Laden failed to achieve on Sept. 11 is now being unleashed by the Israeli-Palestinian war in the West Bank: a clash of civilizations.

In the wake of repeated suicide bombings, it is no surprise that the Israeli Army has gone on the offensive in the West Bank. Any other nation would have done the same. But Ariel Sharon's operation will succeed only if it is designed to make the Israeli-occupied territories safe for Israel to leave as soon as possible. Israel's goal must be a withdrawal from these areas captured in the 1967 war; otherwise it will never know a day's peace, and it will undermine every legitimate U.S. effort to fight terrorism around the globe.

What I fear, though, is that Mr. Sharon wants to get rid of Mr. Arafat in order to keep Israeli West Bank settlements, not to create the conditions for them to be withdrawn.

President Bush needs to be careful that America doesn't get sucked into something very dangerous here. Mr. Bush has rightly condemned Palestinian suicide bombing as beyond the pale, but he is not making clear that Israel's war against this terrorism has to be accompanied by a real plan for getting out of the territories.

Why? Because President Bush, like all the other key players, doesn't want to face the central dilemma in this conflict — which is that while Israel must get out of the West Bank and Gaza, the Palestinians cannot, at this moment, be trusted to run those territories on their own, without making them a base of future operations against Israel. That means some outside power has to come in to secure the borders, and the only trusted powers would be the U.S. or NATO.

Palestinians who use suicide bombers to blow up Israelis at a Passover meal and then declare 'Just end the occupation and everything will be fine' are not believable. No Israeli in his right mind would trust Yasir Arafat, who has used suicide bombers when it suited his purposes, not to do the same thing if he got the West Bank back and some of his people started demanding Tel Aviv.

'The only solution is a new U.N. mandate for U.S. and NATO troops to supervise the gradual emergence of a Palestinian state — after a phased Israeli withdrawal — and then to control its borders,' says the Middle East expert Stephen P. Cohen.

People say that U.S. troops there would be shot at like U.S. troops in Beirut. I disagree. U.S. troops that are the midwife of a Palestinian state and supervise a return of Muslim sovereignty over the holy mosques in Jerusalem would be the key to solving all the contradictions of U.S. policy in the Middle East, not new targets.

The Arab leaders don't want to face this hard fact either, because most are illegitimate, unelected autocrats who are afraid of ever speaking the truth in public to the Palestinians. The Arab leaders are as disingenuous as Mr. Sharon; he says ending 'terrorism' alone will bring peace to the occupied territories, and the Arab leaders say ending 'the occupation' alone will end all terrorism.

Like Mr. Sharon, the Arab leaders need to face facts — that while the occupation needs to end, they independently need to address issues like suicide terrorism in the name of Islam. As Malaysia's prime minister, Mahathir Mohamad, courageously just declared about suicide bombing: 'Bitter and angry though we may be, we must demonstrate to the world that Muslims are rational people when fighting for our rights, and do not resort to acts of terror.'

If Arab leaders have only the moral courage to draw lines around Israel's behavior, but no moral courage to decry the utterly corrupt and inept Palestinian leadership, or the depravity of suicide bombers in the name of Islam, then we're going nowhere.

The other people who have not wanted to face facts are the feckless American Jewish leaders, fundamentalist Christians and neoconservatives who together have helped make it impossible for anyone in the U.S. administration to talk seriously about halting Israeli settlement-building without being accused of being anti-Israel. Their collaboration has helped prolong a colonial Israeli occupation that now threatens the entire Zionist enterprise.

So there you have it. Either leaders of good will get together and acknowledge that Israel can't stay in the territories but can't just pick up and leave, without a U.S.-NATO force helping Palestinians oversee their state, or Osama wins — and the war of civilizations will be coming to a theater near you.


reply by
TheAZCowBoy
4/3/2002 (11:07)
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Re: Torah Jews, God's gift to mankind or just a mirage from the distant past?

There was a time in space when all Jew's of the world were considered 'Torah Jews' and their decency made the arrogant and the hard nosed ones like myself willing to submit to their decency and their spreading of the Holy words brought down from Mt. Sinai by Moses on a stone tablet.

Today we have a new type of parasitic Jew who is a genetic throw back to the days of Attila-the-hun and Ghengis Kahn these are the demons the world regretfully has learned to call the 'Zionists.'

These low lives are the lowest of the low life Jews who have believed that the Jewish State can only exist as a military power subjugating the indigenous people of Palestine and succeeding in this criminal behavior by force of arms.

Supported politically and financially by the nation who 'wrote the book' in the area of genocide and thuggary under the not-so-holy banner of 'Manifest Destiny' this Zionist State has become--like their old allies South Africa--a stronghold of apartheid, racism, bigotry and STATE SPONSORED TERRORIM, a pariah like the world has not known since the hey days days of Pol Plot and Richard Nixon during the US' holocaust in Vietnam.

As the thug LIKUDNIK's close in on Bethlehem with their murderous Merkava tanks, showing the world what bastards they are ( not even allowing the Palestinian's to bury their dead ) one can only predict that DIM BULB will have to fly millions of American's home from all over the world as he has made us the most despicable people on the planet.

The world is a heartbeat away from 'Apocolypse now' under this arrogant incompetant that I call DIM BULB and the American people ( 75% of them if you believe the polls by the fascists at FOX CABLE NEWS ), who like the Roman's that cheered as the Christians were fed to the lion's in their blood drenched coliseum's continue to cheer the genocide being committed by the Zionist bastards against the downtrodden Palestinian's.

Egypt today cut most diplomatic relations with the bloody LUKIDNIK's and look for DIM BULB to come down hard on Mubarak. Let's hope that this US 'puppet' will hold his own against this AWOL semi-draft dodger who like most of the Republican's are 'hawks' until it comes time to don the uniform or send their sissy children to war.

TheAZCowBoy,
reply by
John Calvin
4/3/2002 (14:39)
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Oh Boy, Thomas Friedman! What a treat! In case we all missed any of his assinine editorials in the N.Y. Times or can't get enough surrealist fiction from Rushdie or Ajami!

See this is the problem with the people in this forum: the can't afford the price of the N.Y.Times or CNN and so completely wallow in ignorance and self-deception - just the same as Arabs I suppose. Fortunately, wonderful souls like J.C. exist to help rectify the shortfalls in our education, connected us up to the TRUTH, and give us the real low-down skinny on the President's epoch Infinite Justice/Enduring Freedom Campaign and just how he plans to fit the case of that demon Arafat and his dracula-like zombie followers fit in to the grand scheme of Pax Americana!
reply by
JC
4/3/2002 (15:02)
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You're welcome.

reply by
Ozzie Hooper
4/3/2002 (23:25)
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JC
Thomas Friedman nuseates me. I can't stand him. Here in Atlanta, they print his columns twice a week in the Atlanta Journal Constitution (the only paper, a monopoly on very biased news). Every one of his columns is laced with hatred towards Arabs and Palestinians in particular. His intention goal deeception. Anything he writes about is not worth reading as far as I'm concerned because I have read too many of his columns and they're the same old hate-messages (pro-Israeli propaganda). My husband & I cancelled the paper because they're not worthy our hard earned money.
reply by
JC
4/4/2002 (8:54)
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Ozzie - Sorry to hear you have such a lame paper in Atlanta. I have a similar lame paper in my area. I pay a premium to get the NY Times delivered to my home. Although Friedman is a featured editorial writer, they are definitely not a lackey for Israel. I recommend getting it.

Did you read from Beiruit to Jerusalem? The Lexus and the Olive Tree?

If you believe Friedman is anti-Arab and pro-Israel you are really twisted. The guy is one of the most outspoken critics of the Settlement policy.
reply by
Ozzie
4/4/2002 (22:44)
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Decades have passed and nothing changed. I want to see action, not words JC. Since you say he is an outspoken critic on the settlement issue, why have I never read any such message in his columns for the last three years? I have only read blaming remarks laced with hatred towards Arabs. I e-mailed the editors (Schwartz and Miller of the AJC opinions columns) not once but three times, they didn't even respond back to me. So I cancelled my subscription. I'm sure he hasn't stopped bashing Arabs in the last week on my behalf!