Radical Proposal
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AuthorTopic: Radical Proposal
topic by
Seth Sims
4/6/2002 (24:58)
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A radical plan for Mideast peace
Posted: April 2, 2002
1:00 a.m. Eastern
By - Joseph Farah
WorldNetDaily.com


As the world begins to recognize that a negotiated settlement between Yasser Arafat and Israel can never be achieved – and should never be achieved – it's time to explore more radical ideas.

Arafat always wants more. No proposal for peace will ever be enough because, ultimately, his goal is the destruction of the state of Israel.

Part of the answer, of course, is eliminating Arafat from the equation. He's a terrorist. He's an unrepentant murderer of Israelis and Americans. He's part of the problem, not the solution.

The bigger problem is Islamic domination of the Mideast. The only way there will be peace for Christians and Jews in the region is through the creation of defensible borders.

Israel has defensible borders now. That's why Arafat is trying to break them down. Israel must not allow that to happen.

But what about Christians in the Middle East?

There are millions of them still – even though millions more have been killed or fled official repression and persecution. Rather than dismantle the tiny Jewish state, we should be talking about creating a bastion where Christians can live in peace and with freedom.

Lebanon is the place.

While Arafat steps up persecution of Christians in Bethlehem and Ramallah and throughout his Palestinian Authority territories, Syria, through military occupation of Lebanon, is making Lebanon a hell for the people who once dominated the free and independent country.

The rollback of Syrian occupation should be the No. 1 focal point in any serious effort to achieve Middle East peace. Let Lebanon be Lebanon. Let's have at least two free states in the Middle East. Let's force Syria out. Let's make sure Damascus never gets the idea of imposing its will on Beirut again. In the war on terrorism, this is a vital objective, because Syria has established Lebanon as a major base of terrorist activity.

If we're serious about this war, we cannot stop in Afghanistan. Lebanon has been a hub of terrorist activity ever since the Syrian troops moved in. This is the way Syria sponsors terrorism – by using another sovereign nation as the staging ground. This practice cannot be tolerated any longer.

The first step is recognition of the facts. The U.S. needs to object loudly and strenuously to this outrage. Syria needs to be put on notice. Damascus needs to be warned and given a very short timetable for withdrawal of all military forces from Lebanon. If its troops don't leave, they need to be forced out.

The next step is destruction of Lebanon's terrorist bases – all of them.

And just like in Afghanistan, a new regime – one supported by the people of Lebanon – needs to be installed. Free elections, without coercion from a foreign power, need to be scheduled. Human rights need to be respected again.

Some might say this objective is beyond our means. Yet, there are people in Lebanon just waiting for the relief. They want to be liberated, just as the people of Afghanistan wanted to be liberated. Lebanon, on the other hand, is a much smaller country and more strategically located.

Lebanon has more potential for self-governance because of its recent experience with it. There's a great opportunity to establish another beachhead for freedom – freedom that can be defended with borders and force.

People don't like to talk about force. They like to think negotiations and pieces of paper can protect people. They cannot. That fact should be apparent to even the most casual observer of Middle East politics by now.

The battle lines have never been more clear. Yes, Arafat is the enemy. He is the enemy of peace. He is the enemy of freedom. So is Syria. Its continued occupation of Lebanon is evidence of that. Its sponsorship of terrorism is evidence of that.

It's time to recognize the enemy. It's time to stop mincing words. It's time to stop supporting them as we do with Arafat. It's time to warn them of what's coming. And then it will be time to clean house – as we are doing in Afghanistan.

You want a prescription for peace? That's mine. As long as we remain ambiguous with our enemies – with people seeking to destroy our way of life and oppress their own people – we will continue to live with the daily terrorism, the increasing body counts and, step by step, we will lose our resolve in an endless war of attrition.

Instead, it's a time for decisive action – and decisive victory.
reply by
wisso
4/7/2002 (4:14)
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Seth...r u talking about syrian military occupation....in what kind of world do u live in man...im leanees and i go to lebanon 2 times a month and Syrian checkpoints are extremely rare...and in case u didnt know..they r not Occupiing us..they r defending us against our Neighboor who occupied souther lebanon for 27 years and have ALREADY occupied lebanon with (what a coicidence) Ariel sharon at the head of all this military occupation.... Man i have no idea where u get all this information...it must be my this rough childhood u had that totaly messed up yer head...
Let me remind u that syrian never masacred 1000 palrestinian refugees (sabre n Shatila)....does that bring any memories???
reply by
TheAZCowBoy
4/7/2002 (12:32)
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Poor Seth, you continue to hullucinate. Lemmie explain why I say that-OK?

a. Zionist Israel has 'no' border's. ( you didn't know that, huh? ).

b. Zionist Israel has 'no' CONSTITUTION.

c. Zionist Israel has 'no' BILL OF RIGHTS.

d. Zionist Israel is no democracy ( unless you're Jewish ).

e.Zionist Israel has 'no' shame.

Consequently, the loss of Israel would mean nothing to the world.

The Jews learned nothing from the Holocaust except to become addicted to 'reparations,' and to think America is ridiculing US blacks who are currently suing for reparations.

Hey, if anyone should be receiving them they are these same blacks that were brutalized and exploited by America much as the Jews have been doing to the Palestinians for 35 years now.

As a result of these 'truths' I say to you Seth & JC,

Buzz off!

TheAZCowBoy,
reply by
John Calvin
4/7/2002 (14:15)
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Here's a radical plan: Give Israel and Jordan BACK to Syria!
reply by
_
4/7/2002 (14:57)
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Well easy on seth he is just copying and pasting from the 'armageddon r us. people'. You know the 700 club stuff!
you see zionism in america has a ' so called' jewish face and a so called ' christian' face ..
The reason for this article is not really syria or lebanon.
The reason is some christians still remeber a thing or two about SANCTUARY and JEASUS.. So they might be offended by what is going now at jeauss birth place.
So .. In the true tradition of zionist methodology .. you want to keep these kind of people ' live concious christians' occupied with another Subject that suites them.
Enter lebanon .. A ready made execuse for american christians ' that did not buy the britny spears mantra yet' to feel angry at ..
You see .. It was long decided that lebanon war was between muslims and christians .. Not between palestinians and lebanese like it was really with a push from israel.
So .. the WorldNetDaily starts a campaign against how bad christians are being treated in lebanon ( the lebanese constitution give christians more positions in government than muslims) and to make sure no lebanese people make a fuss.. you kind of implicate syria in it .
This kind of stuff seems too frustrating and far fetched to us in the middle east because we know better .. but to americans .. It is time consuming enough.!
reply by
Seth Sims
4/7/2002 (15:20)
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'The Jews learned nothing from the Holocaust except to become addicted to 'reparations,' and to think America is ridiculing US blacks who are currently suing for reparations.'


Me thinks they learned not to rely on people such as you for their safety and security.
reply by
Wisso
4/7/2002 (15:38)
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seth...Was it hot in that oven?
reply by
OZZIE HOOPER
4/7/2002 (19:09)
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Seth or 'Seething' hate. Whatever you go by: Evidentally, The Abused have become Abusers.

As for safety and security; At one time trespassing on someone's property in the deep south meant your head may be blown off. So people just didn't mess with Texans. There is no need to fear for your security and safety if you stay outside of people's fence.

On Lebanon (me being Lebanese), the constitution of Lebanon was written by the French with most governmental posts to Christians (although Muslims where the majority). Nevertheless, the Lebanese Christians and Muslims lived peacefully side by side and didn't have the degree of animosity towards one another (such as in the civil war) until Israel and America began their game of Manipulation.

As far as reparations, everyone has forgotten the Native Americans. Lets give them back North and South America, Canada, and the Carribean Islands. I'm sure their present reservation life is not enough reparations for their loss.

Better yet, lets dismantle the whole world, DNA every individual that exists and brand them with their appropriate race, then send them to their homeland of origin. Now that would be on the same line of Zionazism.....
reply by
Seth Sims
4/7/2002 (19:58)
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The Decline of Eastern Christian Communities
in the Modern Middle East

by BAT YE'OR

I have been asked to address you today on the decline of Eastern Christian communities in the modern Middle East. This process of Christian demographical declined has, however, been a permanent trend in Islamized lands, sometimes accelerated by specific events, sometimes stabilized. But the process of withering away has always been there from the beginning and, with the passing centuries, Christian populations that formerly constituted majorities dwindled to minorities - even disappearing from certain regions.

Here I wish to stress a point: When, in 1983, I coined a new term, 'dhimmitude,' all those processes by which a society - an ethnic collective group - either managed to survive, defending itself, or was ultimately destroyed. The study of dhimmitude is not the same as the study of the dhimmi condition itself, because dhimmitude concerns the inner politics and inter-relations of a collectivity, which coexists encapsulated within its Islamic environment.

A delicate equilibrium evolved during the centuries of resignation to spoliations and humiliations. But, in the Ottoman Empire, during the 19th century Tanzimat period, that equilibrium was suddenly broken by the immense challenges represented by the total modification of the relationship between the umma (the Muslim community) and the dhimmi populations. Because the Islamic state had granted Jews and Christians a protection in the context of jihad, a holy war, their whole legal status was thereby integrated into a warlike ideology linked with religion. We thus find three inter-related and inseparable elements: a legal status; a war; and a theology.

In the document section of my latest book in English, The Decline of Eastern Christianity under Islam. From Jihad to Dhimmitude, I have published a text from al-Qayrawani, a Tunisian jurist, who died in 966. A brief passage from him will allow us to understand the traditional position on this question:

'Jihad is a precept of Divine institution. Its performance by certain individuals may dispense others from it. We Malikis (one of the four schools of Muslim jurisprudence) maintain that it is preferable not to begin hostilities with the enemy before having invited the latter to embrace the religion of Allah except where the enemy attacks first. They have the alternative of either converting to Islam or paying the poll tax (jizya), short of which, war will be declared against them. '

In the 19th century, when the emancipation of the dhimmis was envisaged in the Ottoman Empire, these three elements proved to be unsurmountable obstacles. By the end of the 18th century, the modernization of the empire had became a matter of urgency in order to maintain its territorial integrity against the annexionist ambitions of both Austria and Russia. Already in 1774, by the treaty of Kuchuk-Kainarjdi, Russia had managed to obtain the right to intercede on behalf of all the Orthodox subjects of the Porte. Russia thereby became the champion of the Slavs and of Eastern Orthodoxy in general, while France defended the interests and privileges of Catholicism. This territorial integrity of the Ottoman Empire, first pledged by France, became the pivotal policy of Europe. It is within this context of territorial integrity of the Ottoman Empire that the emancipation of the Christian rayas - or dhimmis -was envisaged by Europe. This policy was based on the hope that equal rights for all Ottoman subjects and the abolition of the oppression of the rayas would check the revolutionary national movements of the Greeks, the Serbs and other Slavic peoples.

The principle of equal rights was one of those liberal ideas bequeathed by the American and French revolutions. But in Europe the political context was totally different from that in Islamic lands. First, in Christendom the principle of the separation of powers - political and religious - had allowed the development of secularist and anti-clerical trends. The religious minorities: Protestants in a Catholic majority; Catholics in a Protestant majority; and the Jewish communities, were minorities persecuted on a theological basis. Here, the principle of equal rights was only possible through the elimination of theological pressures on European political and juridical systems.

In the Islamic system, however, the situation was exactly the reverse since politics and religion are united. The definition given by the great 14th century historian, Ibn Khaldun, is worth quoting briefly: 'In the Muslim community, the holy war is a religious duty, because of the universalism of the (Muslim) mission and (the obligation) to convert everybody to Islam either by persuasion or by force. Therefore, caliphate and royal authority are united (in Islam), so that the person in charge can devote the available strength to both of them (religion and politics) at the same time'.

Secondly, the so-called 'religious minorities' were still, in some regions, large majorities like the Greeks, the Slavic populations of Serbia, Montenegro, Bosnia-Herzegovina, Bulgaria - and the Armenians in several provinces. But most important, these 'religious minorities' in the Ottoman Empire were in fact the remnants of native ethnic majorities. Two firmans were proclaimed by Sultan Abd al-Majid in 1839 and 1856, promising new laws that would abolish religious inequalities. In the Islamic context, the policy of equal rights for all subjects raised many questions. I will mention a few which are still relevant today:

1. The right for Christians to hold freehold property. According to Muslim jurists, the land conquered by jihad should be considered as fay land, a land that in its totality belongs to the umma - the Islamic community - as a wakf, which the imam administers for the benefit of the umma. The scholar Qudama b. Ja'far (d. circa 932) wrote: 'If the Imam distributes the lands amongst those who captured them, they become 'ushr lands, and their previous owners become slaves. If he does not distribute the lands but leaves them in whole, as a trust to the Muslims, then the poll-tax lies on the necks of their owners, who are free, while their lands are charged with kharaj tax.'

This point is stressed in the 1988 Constitution of Hamas (art. 11), where it applies to any land conquered by Islam. In spite of reforms granting non-Muslims the right to buy land in the Ottoman Empire, they could rarely acquire it. In 1860, the British Consul in Sarajevo reported to the British ambassador at Constantinople: 'Christians [dhimmis] are now permitted to possess real property, but the obstacles which they meet with, when they attempt to acquire it, are so many and vexatious that very few have as yet dared to brave them' . This situation continued till 1875, although in Egypt and Palestine special privileges were granted to Europeans.

2. The second point was the abolition of the Koranic tax, the jizya, which was paid in exchange for 'protection' under the dhimma. Thus, the suppression of the jizya was considered as tantamount to the suppression of the protection itself, which left the dhimmis defenceless.

According to the Shafi'i jurist al-Mawardi (d. 1058):
'The refusal of tributaries to pay the poll tax constitutes a violation of the treaty that was conceded to them. '

According to the 8th century jurist Abu Yusuf: '(...) their lives and possessions are spared only on account of the poll tax. '

At a time of great changes when foreign laws and customs imported from the West were contradicting the shari'a, questions were raised about the source of the law's legitimacy. Today, this question is still a burning issue for islamists: the choice between the Law of Allah - the shari'a - and the principle of secular, man-made, laws. Of course, for Muslim judges the shari'a law always prevails over any other law and therefore the system of dhimmitude was perfect and had to be maintained. Here, we should take a closer look at the principle of 'rights' in general. From whom does a person's 'rights' emanate? The rules of jihad state that the infidel who does not submit has no rights at all. The rights of Jews and Christians are only granted, and protected, if they have submitted to Islamic law.

According to an-Nawawi, a 13th century jurist: 'One is not responsible for having mortally wounded an infidel who is not subjected to a Muslim authority, or of an apostate, even when either one of them recants of his errors before dying. '

In other words, it is the Islamic ruler who guarantees, and is the source of legitimacy regarding the rights of Jews and Christians. This is clearly in contradiction with Western conceptions of Human Rights, which declare that everyone is born free and equal in dignity and in rights. In this respect, too, article 31 of the Hamas Charter stresses the Islamic source of 'rights' for Jews and Christians. President Sadat also confirmed this Muslim point in Washington in 1980. Shocked by the wide publicity given by American Copts to the persecutions of Copts in Egypt, he declared: 'Islam is the best guaranty of security for the Copts in Egypt'. Thus, it is Islam which is the source of rights - not the person's inherent rights.

Equality of rights for all would challenge the Islamic order that stressed the superiority of Muslims over infidels. Should a non-Muslim give orders to a Muslim? A 1993 fatwa, published in Saudi Arabia, dealt precisely with this problem. In a recent booklet, The Road to Victory, published by members of the London-based Hizb ut-Tahrir, one reads: 'In its doctrine, Islam forbids the submission to unbelievers and to their rule.' The question remains open: Should 'ideas' be borrowed from Infidels? Should Muslims become friends with the People of the Book?

3. Testimony in court. According to Islamic law, when there is a conflict between a Muslim and a non-Muslim it has to be judged by a shari'a court, which automatically refuses the testimony of a non-Muslim. In 1875, civil courts were specially created in the Ottoman Empire where such cases might receive the testimony of Christians or Jews. But from the reports of British consuls in the Balkans, and in Syria and Palestine, we find even those courts refusing such testimony.

4. The problem of building new churches and synagogues, or repairing any part of them still applies today in certain Muslim countries.

This concept of equal rights was like a thunder-bolt that would shake and destroy the whole social and legal structure of Islamic society based on the shari'a. And Christians were to suffer from many brutal reprisals because of this evolution. Moreover, the 19th century was a century of genocidal massacres caused by many national uprisings against Ottoman rule in the Balkans. Those Christian revolts led to continual wars and reprisals - with tremendous sufferings on all sides, vast refugee problems, and an upsurge of much religious hatred.

During the Greek war of liberation in 1821, Sultan Mahmud II wrote to his vassal, Muhammad Ali of Egypt, that in the war against the Greeks he had to conform to the rules of jihad: 'the slaying of the rebels and the plunder of their goods, and slavery for their wives and children.' But three years later, a firman confirmed the aman, or protection, to the rebels who had submitted and forbade Muslims to attack them.

In Lebanon, Anglo-French rivalries in the context of the emancipation of the Christians provoked massacres of Christians in both Lebanon and Syria in 1841, 1842, 1845, and especially in 1860. More than 20.000 of them were killed, leaving 10,000 orphans, and 75,000 refugees, and 3.000 women were taken as slaves, not to mention forced conversions. This led to a European intervention and the creation of an autonomous Lebanese Ottoman province with a Christian Governor-General.

Toward the close of the 19th century, the sultan's Christian subjects had the choice between two different paths if they wished to liberate themself from dhimmitude:

1) Autonomy, leading to eventual independance when possible;

2) Integration, within the concept of a secular Arab nation.

The Armenians chose autonomy. They requested that where they were numerous in their ancient provinces, the reforms announced at the Congress of Berlin in 1878 should be applied: a wider representivity in the communal and provincial administration and the permission to build schools and use their own language. In 1892-1894 they suffered massacres that claimed 250.000 victimes; about 30,000 in 1909; and, then, the great genocide of 1915-1917 in the First World War. At that fateful period, many Jacobites, who were living alongside the Armenians in some regions, were also killed.

At the end of the war, the Armenians requested an autonomous region which was refused by the Allied Powers. The Assyrians, who asked for a small autonomous territory where they could feel safe, were also refused; they too suffered massacres in 1933, and again in 1937, in the Jazira region of Iraq. The Lebanese Christians obtained independance through an elarged French mandate.

Those Christians who chose integration were often from the refugee populations living in Syria, Lebanon and Palestine. They thought that Arab nationalism or Syrian nationalism would help them to integrate into a secular Islamic society.

But there was also another aspect of Arab nationalism: this was the opposition to Zionism - the Jewish movement of national liberation - by a future Arab Empire comprising Lebanon, Syria and Palestine. As the American King-Crane Report argued in 1922: Arab nationalism would create a tremendous bond between Muslims and Christians by uniting them against Zionism. The same struggle, and the same hatred against Zionist Jews, would be the best means for the Christians to fully integrate into their Muslim environment. On 28 March 1921, the 3rd Palestinian Congress took place in Haifa. It was constituted mainly by Palestinian Christians. On meeting Winston Churchill, the Colonial Secretary, they gave him a memorandum with arguments from The Protocoles of the Elders of Zion.

At the end of the 20th century, the instability in the Arab Muslim world; the catastrophic economic situation in so many regions; the general radicalisation of Islam; the failure of those Christian dreams for their autonomy, or for secularisation; and the fact that Europe abandoned them, has led to constant emigration. Moreover, the strong and proud Lebanese Christian community, after first being attacked by the PLO, disintegrated in the civil conflict that opposed those of them who were partisans of an independent Lebanon, to their coreligionists who had fought against a Christian political power.

One of the reasons for the indifference concerning the Eastern Christians was that in Europe their tragedy was replaced by that of the 'Palestinian cause' - thanks to Christian mobilization for it. For the past thirty years and more, the 'Palestinian cause', strongly backed by the Vatican, by various Churches, and by influential politians in Europe became the daily preoccupation of the media, and of governments. This cause served as a screen to hide the permanent deterioration of the situation of the Christians themselves in the Middle East and elsewhere: that of the Copts in Egypt; the jihad against Christians and Animists in Sudan; the tragic clashes between Christians and Muslims in Nigeria, the Philippines, East Timor, and other regions. This strange silence was integrated into a deliberate obfuscation of Eastern Christianity's dhimmi history. This history was replaced by the myth of a marvellous Islamic-Christian symbiosis that had existed for centuries before the advent of Zionism. And - it was suggested - since Israel was the cause of such evils, its demise would revive that Middle East 'Golden Age'.

This attitude was well expressed 20 years ago by Robert Brenton Betts in the conclusion to his book, Christians in the Arab East:
'For Israel itself, a successful Christian-Muslim experiment makes Lebanon the most dangerous of all enemies to Zionist survival, for it is a living example of the kind of society the Palestinians have lately advocated in place of the narrowly nationalistic and ethnically based state that is Israel today. (...) The success or failure of the Lebanese Christian communities in perpetuating and restructuring their national society in the coming decades will irrevocably be shared by all Arabic-speaking Christians throughout the Middle East, and will in large part determine the outcome of their centuries-old striving to achieve a truly integrated and egalitarian Arab nation.'

Muslim and Christian writers, priests and politicians again and again repeated this point on the sybiosis. Hence, the importance of 'concealing' history - what the late Jacques Ellul called 'carefully concealing' ; and what a Syriac scholar, Prof. Ben Segal, called 'a conspiracy of silence' by Western academics. Jean-Marie Fiey, a Jesuit scholar, did however write in one of his books on Syriac history that, 'as it is not prohibited', he will neverless say that Assyria is like a big Christian cemetary; and Father Michel Hayek declared in 1967: 'Why not admit clearly - so as to break a taboo and a political proscription - what is so resented in the flesh and in the Christian conscience: that Islam has been the most dreadful torment that ever befell the Church. Christian sensibility has remained traumatized to this day.'

And, thus, this 'Palestinian cause', which was an euphemism for the eventual destruction of Israel, prevented a correct historical analysis of religious, political and sociological realities. But the years, and the decades, went by and Israel did not disappear, whereas the Eastern Christian communities crumbled away through a 'conspiracy of silence'.

Now, if we examine quickly the 19th and 20th century struggles of the dhimmi peoples against their condition of dhimmitude in the Balkans and the Middle East, we see that those populations who chose territorial autonomy or independence were always opposed by jihad. They include the Greeks and the Slav peoples in the European dar al-Islam, and the Armenians, the Assyrians, the Israelis and the Lebanese. The others who chose integration, and an egalitarian Arab nation through Arabism, are today faced with the re-Islamization of Muslim society.

During this century, those Christians Arab nationalists tried by every means to assimilate into their Islamic environment. They fought bravely to retain their political power in Lebanon, and they fought with determination for secularization. Actually, Arab Christian nationalists didn't defend their own rights as Christians, but as Arabs - and, of course, to be an Arab is synonymous with being a Muslim for traditionalist Muslims. The secularist Christians and Muslims now feel threatened by declarations such as that by the late Egyptian Sheikh Muhammad Ghazali in 1992: 'Anyone resisting the imposition of the shari'a was an apostate, who deserved death by the state, or by the hand of a devout Muslim.'

I think that Israel has much to learn from the sad experience of Eastern Christianity, because for centuries Jews shared with Christians the dehumanizing condition of dhimmis. Secondly, Israelis should reflect on Europe's conscious abandonment of the Lebanese Christians, and of its cynical choice between moral principles, on the one hand, and oil and Arab markets on the other. Israelis might reflect on how easily foreign states can provoke internecine strife when wishing to destroy a country. And moderate Muslims, who rarely bother to fight for the defence of the 'rights' of their Jewish and Christian persecuted countrymen, are now being aggressed by the same forces of extremist obscurantism that previously targeted the dhimmis - as in Egypt, Algeria, and other Islamic lands.

One can only hope that the ongoing Middle East Peace Process between Israel and the Palestinians, and with the neighbouring Arab states, will benefit all the peoples of the region, although that will depend on the final peace conditions. If the Palestinian Christians - about 2% of the population in all the autonomous territories, though playing internationally a political role disproportionate to their numbers - continue, as in the past, to seek Israel's demise, they will only encourage the most radical anti-Christian Islamists. And the same can be said about the basic anti-Zionist policy of some European states. But if, as a result of peace with Israel, the Muslims peoples will renounce the ideology of jihad; if they will acknowledge the long history of dhimmitude - and especially the fact that Jews and Christians are their equals in rights and dignity - then a future Middle East, built on peace and reconciliation, will indeed have been built on solid foundations. Real peace, to endure, must rest on a total change of mentalities on all sides, and a refusal of jihad ideologies that debase the human being. This is the challenge of the future, which should unite everyone today: Jews, Christians and Muslims.
reply by
truth
4/7/2002 (21:58)
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Palestinians under seige in Betlehem Just Declared that most of the shooters on the roof tops with the israelli army ( WHO HAVE BEEN TALKING THROUGH MICOPHONES URGING THERE SURRENDER) are from the dissolved south lebanese army!! ( THEY CAN TELL BY THE ACCENT) .
These are the people that worked for israel in the 27 years they occupied south lebanon.
Recently .. those people ( who immigrated to israel after israel withdrew from lebanon) are starting to go back to lebanon to face death sentences some times and some times less harsh sentences.. according to them ..( THEY ARE BEING TREATED AS DOGS IN ISRAEL.) and they rather face there own justice than live in ISRAEL!
Wake up and smell the shit you are pushing seth. It is old .. You should answer the post about the talmud so less people think you are pedofile and a theif. rather than try to spread these pethetic lies in a forum that actually have middle eastern muslims postings that would kick your ass every time you make some thing up!