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AuthorTopic: This Forum is Great.
topic by
susan
4/25/2002 (8:03)
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I have never had such a great deal of information before. It only shows how ignorant one could be if one listens to only one side of the story.
Now I feel more educated.
Thank Mr. Mark for such a great forum.
reply by
bullshit detector
4/25/2002 (9:19)
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Peleeeeeeeeeeezzzzzzzze.

How stupid do you think we are?
reply by
Arab leaders are to blame
4/25/2002 (9:54)
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Peters quotes Jordan's late King Hussein: 'Arab leaders ... have used the Palestine people for selfish political purposes. This is ridiculous ... even criminal.' She quotes Syria's former Prime Minister Khaled Al-Axm: 'Since 1948, it is we who demanded the return of the refugees ... while it is we who made them leave. ... We brought disaster upon ... Arab refugees. ... We have rendered them dispossessed. ... We have accustomed them to begging. ... We have participated in lowering their moral and social level. ... Then we exploited them in executing crimes of murder, arson and throwing bombs upon ... men, women and children -- all this in the service of political purposes.'
reply by
smart
4/25/2002 (11:07)
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So the Jews are not to be blamed !!!???
This is an Evil logic.
Remember the history;
The Present Arab States were made up by the British and French colonialist; Jews had a good share in the politics of
the post WWII era. As they are now!! The main decision makers in the Governments of the Arab new States were chosen carefully with the advice of the Zionist lobbies in both countries. 'Jewish Muslims' in disguise,
and Muslim and Christian masons are, unto this moment, holding key positions in every Department of every Ministry of these 'Arab' Governments. Knowing this fact you can extrapolate all the events in the past, present and future realities in the Arab World. The Arab peoples were always the victims of this Chronic Evil Aggression..Unsurpassed.
reply by
Celia
4/25/2002 (11:38)
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groan!

But of course, it is never the Arab's fault. It is always the fault of the Jews or France, or England, or America.

Well I say, if you are going to act like a little child, you are going to get treated like a little child.
reply by
resources
4/25/2002 (11:54)
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go..to.. (1).. palestinehistory.com ...(2).. abunimah.org
reply by
resources
4/25/2002 (11:56)
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go..to..(1)..Ramallah..(2)..Baghdad..(3)..Hell
reply by
Sam
4/25/2002 (12:00)
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Celia..
The Arabs : 'The People ' have never stoped fighting.
Sharon and Zionist semihumans were always fighting the People, not the Rulers. And you can see the Rulers are jews. They are Trojan horses.
reply by
Celia
4/25/2002 (12:07)
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Who is Jewish?
Mubarak?
Hussein?
Assad?
Abdullah?
Arafat?

You're almost as nutty as the Cowboy.
reply by
truth
4/25/2002 (12:53)
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Dear celia .. Every ruler you have posted in this message was put into power by american and european influences thinking it serves there INTERESTS to go against democracy and pack these leader ... GUESS WHO CONVINCED THEM TO THINK THAT WAY!!!
reply by
truth
4/25/2002 (12:58)
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Dear celia .. To prove my point .. and since the example is crying to be published..
KEEP AN EYE ON PAKISTAN .. GENERAL MUSHARAF GOT INTO POWER BY A MILLITARY REVOLT...
EVER SINCE HE GOT TO POWER HE IS BEEN DECLARING SWITCH TO GENERAL ELECTIONS IN PAKISTAN NO LATER THAN end of 2002 .. IN THE LAST 4 MONTHS .. AND AFTER USA GOT PERMISSION TO EXECUTE MILITARY OPERATIONS INSIDE PAKISTAN AND ACTUALLY KILL PAKISTANI CITIZENS UPON SUSPISSIONS .. HE IS NOW DECLARING NO ELECTIONS AND INSTEAD A MIDDLE EASTERN STYLE REFERENDOM UPON HIS OWN PRESIDENCY ( either to fake .. only his name on the palate ) THIS WEEK MORE THAN 1000 POLITICAL PARTIES LEADERS HAVE BEEN THROWN IN JAIL WITH USA APPROVAL JUST FOR ASKING FOR ELECTIONS TO BE HELD.
THEY AVE BEEN ALREADY LABELLED AS ISLAMMIC MILLITANTS.
Democracy as you people understand it is just an execuse to all the power elite ( mostly zionists and pro israelli psudo-christian nutss) to controll the masses via money and interest!!!!
reply by
Sam
4/25/2002 (13:30)
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Thanks truth !
You explained the truth better than I did ..I like you name..
reply by
truth
4/25/2002 (13:38)
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No problem Sam.

Thanks for putting that Christian in his place.
reply by
truth
4/25/2002 (13:51)
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of course 'thanks for putting this Christian in his place ' is not written by me .. you can not have facts on your side and go insulting others .. this is of course is Seth using my nick again.
further more .. since Muslims look at Christians as holy book people .. this would have been blasphemy if I would have written it.!
thank god that the new Jews managed to forget there own religion in there education .. the problem now .. i feel sympathy for all those liberal Jews who do not follow the Talmud .. but were brought up thinking like every nation that they were on the right side of things .. the real trial today is for them in discovering that the whole essence of liberalism to which they thought is there ticket out of despise in the world does not explain there own religion practice in Israel which basically mount to RACISM in its purist forms..
It is really funny if you think about it .. this is when ben laden theology also fell short .. in the practical application of fundamentalism in Afghanistan.!!! it also failed because of his own hatred taking rule over his religious translation .. you see ben laden was a business major too :))
Every one who sways far away from god's road ends up with no anchor.
No matter if you adopt socialism or capitalism .. you end up harming people because you have no anchor .. no conscious!
USA is the hope for the world because its constitution provides for correcting the course of such excess.. Let us hope that we Americans have the patience and the resolve to do our part in doing this.

reply by
truth
4/25/2002 (14:01)
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Dear susan .. it is great .. But addicting as heck.!
reply by
TheAZCowboy
4/25/2002 (14:01)
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This is a sad time for all Americans, and all peace loving people of the world who wonder what drove the terrorists to cause unspeakable harm to so many innocent people and ultimately to themselves. What could possibly motivate this action? What was there to be gained? The impetus for such a heinous crime must have been very powerful indeed. And that drive and motivation still exists in the world today. But where is this faceless enemy? How do we stop it if we don’t even know what it is? This disaster has changed our lives forever.

We have heard ad nauseum the rhetoric that this was a ‘senseless act’ and if we ‘think about it for a thousand years it will still never make sense to us’. This is an extremely dangerous position for America to assume. It was ignorance of the motivations and hatred that allowed us to get ‘sucker-punched’ by these terrorists. And until we get inside their heads and understand what motivates them to this level of self-destruction, we are leaving ourselves exposed to additional attacks.

We have all heard that this was beyond the worst-case scenario that our leaders have anticipated. Unfortunately, this is far from the worst-case. Even the concept of slamming a jumbo-jet into the Capitol building was the climax in a Tom Clancy book from several years ago. But so are other even more deadly fictional terrorist acts including nuclear detonations in population centers and biological warfare on a large scale. These are ‘fictional’… for the moment anyway.

Pakistan is on the verge of a civil war with its Muslim fundamentalists trying to overthrow the Pakistani government because it sympathizes with the US. These fundamentalist Muslims are sympathetic to the Afghan Taliban regime and Usama bin Laden. Oh, and Pakistan has nuclear weapons. Let’s not forget our old pal Saddam and his biological and chemical weapons of choice.

We have all heard from our leaders that ‘we are not at war with Islam’, and that ‘there is nothing in Islam that condones this type of deplorable action’. And truly, there are many Muslims in this country and the world that deplore these heinous crimes. Watching Dan Rather weep with David Letterman over these horrific acts was a moving thing to watch, but when asked 'Why?' we are simply told over and over that we ‘just don’t know’. We are told that the Muslims are a peace-loving people and that their religious beliefs are benign and peaceful. So it can’t be that… or can it?

I don’t expect Dan Rather would have ever read the Qur’an (the holy ‘bible’ of Islam). I don’t believe that the ‘talking heads’ on TV have done all that much in-depth research into the subject of Islamic religion and beliefs. For the most part, they are reading the scripts that have been generated by the policy makers in the newsrooms and the media moguls. And the ‘party-line’ is that Islam is a peace-loving religion that wouldn’t dream of doing such a dastardly deed. But yet we see images of Muslims partying over the death of thousands of innocent lives. Many are calling for a ‘jihad’ or ‘holy war’ against the United States. ‘Holy War’ is an oxymoron. There is nothing remotely ‘holy’ about it.

Something just isn’t adding up. I know I am not the only one that is confused over the rhetoric versus the images that I am seeing and the reality and the horror of the actions. The words just don’t fit the actions. But why? What is being instilled into these terrorists to make them act the way they do? Where does it come from?

Please read the following paragraphs with the understanding that these words are unaltered words from the Qur’an. (The Qur’an was written in Arabic, but like the Holy Bible, has been translated into English with the most popular and purportedly the most accurate being the Yusuf Ali translation from which these passages are quoted). No editorial license has been taken here, nor has any emphasis been added. Lest you think that these passages have been taken out of context or altered in any way, I have included the Sura chapter and verse for each.

Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits, for Allah does not love transgressors. 2:190

And slay them wherever you catch them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out, for tumult and oppression are worse than slaughter. 2:191

And fight them on until there is no more tumult or oppression, and let there prevail justice and faith in Allah; but if they cease, let there be no hostility except to those who practice oppression. 2:193

Fighting is prescribed for you, and you dislike it. But it is possible that you dislike a thing which is good for you, and that you love a thing which is bad for you. But Allah knows, and you know not. 2:216

Let those fight in the cause of Allah who sell the life of this world for the Hereafter. To him who fights in the cause of Allah, - whether he is slain or gets victory – soon shall We give him a reward of great value. 4:74

Of the Unbelievers: 'seize them and slay them wherever you find them: and in any case take no friends or helpers from their ranks.' 4:89

Allah has granted a grade higher to those who strive and fight with their goods and persons than to those who sit at home. 4:95

…'for the Unbelievers are open enemies to you.' 4:101

For the Unbelievers, Allah has prepared a humiliating punishment. 4:102

O People of the Book! Commit no excesses in your religion: nor say of Allah anything but the truth. Christ Jesus the son of Mary was no more than a Messenger of Allah… Do not say 'Trinity': desist: it will be better for you: for Allah is One God: Glory be to Him: far exalted is He above having a son. 4:171

From those too, who call themselves Christians, We did take a covenant, but they forgot a good part of the Message that was sent to them: so We estranged them, with enmity and hatred between one and the other, to the Day of Judgment. And soon will Allah show them what they have done. 5:14

In blasphemy indeed are those that say that God is Christ the son of Mary. 5:17

O you who believe! Take not the Jews and the Christians for your friends and protectors: they are but friends and protectors to each other. And he among you that turns to them for friendship is of them. 5:51

They do blaspheme who say: 'God is Christ the son of Mary.' They do blaspheme who say: God is one of three in a trinity: for there is no God except one God Allah. If they do not desist from their word of blasphemy, verily a grievous penalty will befall the blasphemers among them. Christ the son of Mary was no more than a Messenger; many were the Messengers that passed away before him. 5:72- 73, 5:75

Of the Jews: ‘When in their insolence they transgressed all prohibitions, We said to them: 'Be you apes, despised and rejected.'’ 7:166

'Many are the men We have made for Hell…' 7:179

Remember your Lord inspired the angels with the message: 'I am with you: give firmness to the Believers: I will instill terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers: you smite them above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off them.' 8:12

Against them make ready your strength to the utmost of your power, including steeds of war, to strike terror into the hearts of the enemies of Allah. Whatever you spend in the cause of Allah shall be repaid to you and you shall not be treated unjustly. 8:60

O Messenger! Rouse the Believers among you to the fight. If there are twenty amongst you, patient and persevering, they will vanquish two hundred: if a hundred, they will vanquish two thousand of the Unbelievers: for these are people without understanding. 8:65

…Then fight and slay the Pagans wherever you find them, seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem of war…9:5

Fight them and Allah will punish them by your hands, cover them with shame, help you to victory over them, heal the breasts of the Believers. 9:14

Fight those who do not believe in Allah … until they pay the Jizya with willing submission and feel themselves subdued. 9:29

… Allah will send His punishment from Himself or by our hands. 9:52

Therefore, when you meet the Unbelievers in fight, smite at their necks; at length, when you have thoroughly subdued them, bind a bond firmly on them… He lets you fight in order to test you, some with others. But those who are slain in the way of Allah, - He will never let their deeds be lost. 47:4

It is He Who got out the Unbelievers among the People of the Book from their homes at the first gathering of the forces. Little did you think that they would get out: and they thought that their fortresses would defend them from Allah! But the wrath of Allah came to them from quarters from which they had little expected it, and cast terror into their hearts, so that they destroyed their own dwellings by their own hands and the hands of the Believers. 59:2

That is because they resisted Allah and His Messenger: and if any one resists Allah, verily Allah is severe in punishment. Whether you cut down O you Muslims the tender palm-trees, or if you left them standing on their roots, it was by leave of Allah, and in order that He might cover with shame the rebellious transgressors. 59:4,5

They will not fight you even together, except in fortified townships, or from behind walls. Strong is their fighting spirit amongst themselves: you would think they are united, but their hearts are divided: that is because they are a people devoid of wisdom. 59:14

Truly Allah loves those who fight in His Cause in battle array, as if they were a solid cemented structure. 61:4

This is but a small sampling of the hatred and violence that permeates this book. This book is the very foundation upon which this religion is founded. This just doesn’t wash with the ‘peace-loving people’ rhetoric but it does begin to explain the motivation and the actions we see on the TV and now in our own backyards.

Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world, partly because it is so popular with those who despise America and all it stands for. The very passages you read above and many more like it are being taught to little children throughout the world. This ‘religious training’ is virtually guaranteeing that the next generation of terrorists is being groomed for violence and hatred while America digs out from the rubble of the last attacks.

Detractors will say 'What about all the hatred and violence that has been caused in the name of Christianity?' It is true that there have been many atrocities committed on behalf of Christianity (Spanish Inquisition, and others). But none of these atrocities are in harmony with the teachings of our Lord Jesus Christ, nor are they grounded in any of the writings or principles of the New Testament. In fact these acts are diametrically opposed to the teachings and writings of Jesus who affirmed the greatest commandment(s): 'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like unto it: Love your neighbor as yourself. All the Law and all the Prophets hang on these two commandments.' Mt. 22:37-40

Christians are tasked by Jesus to follow the ‘Great Commission’ found in Mt. 28:19 'Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching everything that I have commanded you.' The basic tenet of the Christian faith is that all people are created in the image of God and are valuable to Him. The basic tenet of Islam is that some people are chosen by God to be Muslim, and the others are created for Hell. Christians strive to tell others about God’s love and sacrifice for us. Many Muslims want to expedite Allah’s plan for us infidels to go straight to Hell at their hands. And if they are killed in the process of killing us, great will be their reward.

Most Muslims are not associated with the horrible people that perpetrate terrorism. And some people that call themselves ‘Christians’ have done equally horrific acts. This is not meant to be in indictment for any people anywhere. Only God knows what is truly in our hearts and only God will sit in judgment of us all. But as a rational person, and a man that has read both the Bible and the Qur’an from cover-to-cover, I am well informed and prepared to take a stand for truth. The truth is that Islam is a man-made religion, full of hatred and venom and the followers of this horrible cult are being led away from God and salvation at an astonishing pace.

As Christians we cannot allow any knee-jerk reactions to the horrific acts against our nation and our people, lest we fall into the same snare that has engulfed the perpetrators of this crime. 'For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.' Ep. 6:12 The Muslim people are not our enemies; they are our brothers and sisters that are lost in the snares of the enemy’s trap and need our help.

The Muslim religion was created many hundreds of years after Christ. Mohammed, the Islam prophet, was born around AD 570. But Muslims believe that Islam is the true religion dating back to Adam and that the biblical patriarchs were all Muslim including Noah, Abraham, Moses, and even the Lord Jesus Christ. Today we see evidence that more and more Muslims are putting the Qur’ans’ hatred of Christians and Jews alike into practice. We watch as they train for the ‘jihad’ by shooting at targets with the cross of Christ painted on the chests. There is a major battle to be fought in the months and years ahead. It is not a battle of America against Islam, but a battle of good versus evil. But I for one am wary of a people that embrace a religion based on a book filled with hatred while proclaiming peace.

As Operation Infinite Justice is unleashed, we will undoubtedly be drawn into emotional struggles and turmoil as we wrestle with what is right and wrong. Unlike what we have been hearing for years from the ‘politically correct’, there ARE absolute truths; there IS a right and a wrong. But the media has been ‘drinking it’s own bathwater’ for so long that they have convinced themselves that every religion is ‘right’ and nobody is ‘wrong’. And we can all live in peace and harmony because everybody’s religion teaches them peace and harmony. Or does it? Let this tragedy be a powerful lesson to us all. It is time to wake up from the ‘ignorance-is-bliss’ mentality and get into the heads of these hateful people, recognize and acknowledge the root of the problem. Or we might just wake up in the middle of another Tom Clancy novel.

It is time for the world to wake up. We demand answers from the Islamic religious leaders. We are tired of the platitudes and disingenuous ‘lip-service’ that is in direct contrast to their actions. We are sick of the rhetoric of peace while they are running training camps of hatred and war. We are appalled by the false claims that the teachings of Islam do not condone the acts of the terrorists when the Qur’an reads like a terrorist manifesto. We are not fooled by the speeches of Yassir Arafat about how saddened he and his followers are while his followers are in the streets outside his headquarters in a carnival-like atmosphere celebrating the carnage of innocent people in America.

Americans are not stupid people. We were asleep to the danger that awoke us on September 11, 2001. We were sucker-punched. But that only happens once. America is regaining its bearings and composure. We are burying our dead and mourning the loss of family, friends, neighbors and our naiveté. We are carefully evaluating our position, identifying and targeting our enemies. And sadly, we have protected our enemies under the often-misguided umbrella of ‘tolerance’. But we won’t be fooled again.

Now is the time for answers. We need to hear from the Islamic religious leaders how ‘jihad’ has become the driving force in their religion that is supposed to be based in peace and love. And we need to hear how these ‘peace loving’ people can reconcile all of these issues and still claim to be peaceful. Unless we hear from these Islamic leaders very quickly, and in some very compelling terms, I know that millions of Americans will foster deep-rooted fear, resentment and mistrust of all Muslims, whether they are US citizens or desert Bedouins. We need to know why you believe that you should not be held accountable for these actions along with the others who perished in the blaze.

We will undoubtedly experience additional terrorist attempts or strikes from within our own borders perpetrated by the remaining cell groups interspersed and hiding among the Muslim population. But we will be watching very, very closely. And this may make a number of Muslims in this country uncomfortable. Deal with it. Because it is never going away as long as you embrace a religion that is hostile to peace-loving Christians, Jews, and anybody that does not conform to your beliefs.

We have been attacked by a very savage evil. This attack was much worse than Pearl Harbor as this was not an attack on a military machine but on innocent people who were going about their lives in a peaceful and ordinary fashion. And the perpetrators of this act of war have declared war on us with the battle cry of 'Jihad'. I do not need any more evidence to indict the faith of Islam as culpable in this act. President Bush announced that we would prosecute this war on terrorism against the terrorists and make no distinction between them and the nation states that harbor and protect them. But what about the religious infrastructure that has created the terrorists by teaching them to hate and kill anything that does not fit their mold? Should this be immune from attack because it calls itself a religion? If Adolph Hitler called Nazism a religion, would we be speaking German today? Clearly this is at the root of the problem and needs to be addressed unless we intend to live in a world envisioned by the leaders of the Taliban regime.

reply by
truth
4/25/2002 (14:10)
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Even though it is hellarious to single out islam to be the VIOLENT relegion between the 3 abrahamic faith judging by the amount of blood spelled by so called christian or by the activism of jews.
I am ordered by my relegion to provide knowledge to those who seek it . so here is some real translation of the scripture..


Islam & Violence


Save a Life, Save All Humanity--Take a Life, Kill All Humanity
What the Islamic scriptures really say about jihad and violence.



For years Islamic terrorists have justified their actions as being compelled by their faith. Osama Bin Laden reportedly thanked Allah when he heard the news of this week's attack. Other terrorist groups invoke Islam as well. Hezbollah, the name of one militant group, is the Arabic word for Party of God; Hamas is the Islamic Resistance Movement.

Are the terrorists who cite the Qur'an distorting the spirit of the religion or depicting its emphasis accurately? Here are several of the Qur'an passages most frequently cited, and analysis from Islamic scholars.

On Jihad or 'Holy War'

Chapter 2, verse 190: Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for Allah loves not transgressors.




This portion of the Qur'an was written in about 606 C.E., when the Prophet Muhammad and his followers were under attack in the city of Medinah, says Imam Yahya Hendi, a Qur'anic scholar who is the Muslim chaplain at Georgetown University. There, they had established their own state. But various coalitions of non-Muslim tribes--including Christians, Jews, atheists and animists--continued to go to war with them. This portion of the Qur'an explains their reasoning behind striking back.

The passage actually refers to a defensive war. 'You fight back. You go as far as it takes to stop the aggression but you do not go beyond that. So if you have to, you go as far as fighting verbally to get someone out of your home--but you don't shoot him after he is out. You don't keep going on with it--only if you are attacked, if there is an oppression applied to you. The idea is that justice prevails. You don't fight because you enjoy fighting, but because there is an oppression.

'It could be military force or [in today's world] it could be media force, writing against you. But when the hostilities are over and the enemy offers a peace treaty, you should submit. Muslims are obliged to submit to a peace treaty offered by the enemy. You don't keep fighting.'

Al-Hajj Talib 'Abdur-Rashid, imam of the Mosque of Islamic Brotherhood in Harlem, says the word jihad has its origin in the verb jahada which means to struggle, to fight. The word has a few different connotations, since struggle can occur on several levels.

'Muslims understand these levels based not only on the words of Allah in the Qur'an, but also on the authentic statements of the Prophet Muhammad as recorded in our oral traditions, preserved as hadith,' he says. According to 'Abdur-Rashid, there are three levels of jihad:

Personal Jihad: The most excellent jihad is that of the soul. This jihad, called the Jihadun-Nafs, is the intimate struggle to purify the soul of satanic influence--both subtle and overt. It is the struggle to cleanse one's spirit of sin. This is the most important level of jihad.

Verbal Jihad: On another occasion, the Prophet said, 'The most excellent jihad is the speaking of truth in the face of a tyrant.' He encouraged raising one's voice in the name of Allah on behalf of justice.

Physical Jihad: This is combat waged in defense of Muslims against oppression and transgression by the enemies of Allah, Islam and Muslims. We are commanded by Allah to lead peaceful lives and not transgress against anyone, but also to defend ourselves against oppression by 'fighting against those who fight against us.' This 'jihad with the hand' is the aspect of jihad that has been so profoundly misunderstood in today's world.





On Non-Muslims

Chapter 2, verse 256: Let there be no compulsion in religion: Truth stands out clear from Error: whoever rejects evil and believes in Allah hath grasped the most trustworthy hand-hold, that never breaks. And Allah heareth and knoweth all things.




This passage has been cited to justify expelling non-Muslims from Muslim countries. But Imam Hendi says that not only does the Qur'an avoid any such suggestion, it even prohibits aggressive efforts to convert. 'No Muslim is allowed to go out and force people to become Muslim. In the early days of Islam, Jews came to Islam and had younger children and asked Muhammad if they could force Islam on their children because they are younger. This verse [which was] revealed to him says that there can be no compulsion on other religions. This is very clear.

'I have had people come to my office and say they wanted to convert to Islam. I talked to them and it turned out they just weren't happy in their own faiths. So I said, no, go back to your own faith.'

What's more, fundamentalist Muslims seldom cite the passages of the Qur'an which are quite religious pluralistic. For instance, chapter 29, verse 46, says: 'And dispute ye not with the People of the Book, except with means better (than mere disputation), unless it be with those of them who inflict wrong (and injury): but say, 'We believe in the revelation which has come down to us and in that which came down to you; Our Allah and your Allah is one; and it is to Him we bow (in Islam).''

People of the Book is the term Muslims use to refer to Jews and Christians. 'This is the most-viewed verse in terms of how we talk to non-Muslims. We have common ground between us and them,' says Imam Hendi.


On Martyrdom:

Chapter 3, verse 169: Think not of those who are slain in Allah's way as dead. Nay, they live, finding their sustenance in the presence of their Lord.
Chapter 3, verse 172: Of those who answered the call of Allah and the Messenger, even after being wounded, those who do right and refrain from wrong have a great reward.'

Does Islam have a special emphasis on martyrdom? Those who believe so often look at these verses. Imam Hendi says there is, indeed, a special place for those who die in the service of God, though that service needs to be of a different sort than that provided by terrorists. 'Suppose I'm on the pulpit teaching and giving my sermon,' says Imam Hendi. 'If someone shoots me because of what I'm saying about God, the Qur'an says I'm not really dead because I'm with God. If I'm feeding the poor, and calling for justice, I can't be called dead. My soul is alive and God sustains me.'

'If you are a teacher in a school and you die while teaching, you are a martyr. If you die while doing a service for people, you are a martyr. If I am traveling on American Airlines 700 going to London for a conference or to learn something, if that plane, God forbid, crashes, I am a martyr. Travelers for learning are martyrs.

So to claim martyr status, all terrorists have to do is convince themselves that they are fighting for 'justice,' which is, of course, highly subjective. 'They say that America is the leader of injustice worldwide because of the embargo against Afghanistan, and the thousands of people suffering in Iraq. Some people think America has a double standard when it comes to the Middle East and Israel. [Terrorists] think if they hurt Americans, they serve the cause of justice. They use these verses,' says Imam Hendi.

But the Qur'an has just as many passages describing how martyrdom cannot cause harm to others. 'The prophet Muhammad said, 'Do not attack a temple a church, a synagogue. Do not bring a tree or a plant down. Do not harm a horse or a camel. He went on and on in detail about what Muslims cannot do.'

On Terrorism and Violence

Obviously the Qur'an doesn't condone terrorism, though Muhammed was the leader of a military force and therefore used violence. 'In the West,' writes scholar Karen Armstrong in her book, Muhammad, 'we often imagine Muhammad as a warlord, brandishing his sword in order to impose Islam on a reluctant world by force of arms. The reality was quite different. Muhammad and the first Muslims were fighting for their lives, and they had also undertaken a project in which violence was inevitable.'

It is true, she says, that unlike Christianity, Islam's leader was not a pacifist. 'Islam fight tyranny and injustice. A Muslim may feel that he has a sacred duty to champion the weak and the oppresed,' she writes. 'Fighting and warfare might sometimes be necessary, but it was only a minor part of the whole jihad or struggle. A well-known tradition (hadith) has Muhammad say on returning froma battle, 'We return from the little jihad to the greater jihad,' the more difficult and crucial effort to conquer the forces of evil in oneself and and in one's own society in all the details of daily life.'

While there are passages in the Qur'an, like the Old Testament of the Bible, that celebrate military victory, the overall gestalt of the Qur'an promotes a more restrained view. Chapter 5, verse 32, for instance, states: On that account: We ordained for the Children of Israel that if any one slew a person--unless it be for murder or for spreading mischief in the land--it would be as if he slew the whole people: and if anyone saved a life, it would be as if he saved the life of the whole people.

That passages places a great value on the sanctity of a single life. 'If you kill one person it's as if you kill all humanity,' says Imam Hendi.

Indeed, Hendi says, the Qur'an goes one step further in chapter 8, verse 61, 'But if the enemy incline towards peace, do thou (also) incline towards peace, and trust in Allah.'


reply by
truth
4/25/2002 (14:20)
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THE Pact of Umar is the body of limitations and privileges entered into by treaty between conquering Muslims and conquered non-Muslims. We have no special treaty of this sort with the Jews, but we must assume that all conquered peoples, including the Jews, had to subscribe to it. Thus the laws cited below and directed against churches apply to synagogues too. The Pact was probably originated about 637 by Umar I after the conquest of Christian Syria and Palestine. By accretions from established practices and precedents, the Pact was extended; yet despite these additions the whole Pact was ascribed to Umar. There are many variants of the text and scholars deny that the text as it now stands could have come from the pen of Umar I; it is generally assumed that its present form dates from about the ninth century.

The Pact of Umar has served to govern the relations between the Muslims and 'the people of the book,' such as Jews, Christians, and the like, down to the present day.

In addition to the conditions of the Pact listed below, the Jews, like the Christians, paid a head-tax in return for protection, and for exemption from military service. Jews and Christians were also forbidden to hold government office. This Pact, like much medieval legislation, was honored more in the breach than in the observance. In general, though, the Pact increased in stringency with the centuries and was still in force in the 20th century in lands such as Yemen. The Pact is in Arabic.

In the name of God, the Merciful, the Compassionate!

This is a writing to Umar from the Christians of such and such a city. When You [Muslims] marched against us [Christians],: we asked of you protection for ourselves, our posterity, our possessions, and our co-religionists; and we made this stipulation with you, that we will not erect in our city or the suburbs any new monastery, church, cell or hermitage; that we will not repair any of such buildings that may fall into ruins, or renew those that may be situated in the Muslim quarters of the town; that we will not refuse the Muslims entry into our churches either by night or by day; that we will open the gates wide to passengers and travellers; that we will receive any Muslim traveller into our houses and give him food and lodging for three nights; that we will not harbor any spy in our churches or houses, or conceal any enemy of the Muslims. [At least six of these laws were taken over from earlier Christian laws against infidels.]

That we will not teach our children the Qu'ran [some nationalist Arabs feared the infidels would ridicule the Qu'ran; others did not want infidels even to learn the language]; that we will not make a show of the Christian religion nor invite any one to embrace it; that we will not prevent any of our kinsmen from embracing Islam, if they so desire. That we will honor the Muslims and rise up in our assemblies when they wish to take their seats; that we will not imitate them in our dress, either in the cap, turban, sandals, or parting of the hair; that we will not make use of their expressions of speech, nor adopt their surnames [infidels must not use greetings and special phrases employed only by Muslims]; that we will not ride on saddles, or gird on swords, or take to ourselves arms or wear them, or engrave Arabic inscriptions on our rings; that we will not sell wine [forbidden to Muslims]; that we will shave the front of our heads; that we will keep to our own style of dress, wherever we may be; that we will wear girdles round our waists [infidels wore leather or cord girdles; Muslims, cloth and silk].

That we will not display the cross upon our churches or display our crosses or our sacred books in the streets of the Muslims, or in their market-places; that we will strike the clappers in our churches lightly [wooden rattles or bells summoned the people to church or synagogue]; that we will not recite our services in a loud voice when a Muslim is present; that we will not carry Palm branches [on Palm Sunday] or our images in procession in the streets; that at the burial of our dead we will not chant loudly or carry lighted candles in the streets of the Muslims or their market places; that we will not take any slaves that have already been in the possession of Muslims, nor spy into their houses; and that we will not strike any Muslim.

All this we promise to observe, on behalf of ourselves and our co-religionists, and receive protection from you in exchange; and if we violate any of the conditions of this agreement, then we forfeit your protection and you are at liberty to treat us as enemies and rebels.

reply by
truth
4/25/2002 (14:28)
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The reason this pact was done with christians is the fact that this was done inside the church.
Jews have had 3 + pacts during the life of MUHAMMED (puh) wich is the only authority when it comes to islam not umar .. and even mohammed authority is overridden by the koran!.
the jews have broken all 3+ pacts they made with the prophet. they even tried to assasinate him.
Umar was a very rightous muslim .. he was a very STRONG muslim .. it is beyond my imagination to see UMAR of all peope enter in a pact with people who tried to kill the prophet(puh). How ever .. even UMAR is ruled by the koran .. therefore he had to provide for the security of all jews within the muslim land at his time.!
But zionist history only reports abuses unfortunately.. not justice!
reply by
truth
4/25/2002 (14:31)
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PROPHET MUHAMMAD'S
CHARTER OF PRIVILEGES TO CHRISTIANS
LETTER TO THE MONKS OF ST. CATHERINE MONASTERY

Dr. A. Zahoor and Dr. Z. Haq
(Copyright 1990, 1997, All Rights Reserved)







In 628 C.E. Prophet Muhammad (s) granted a Charter of Privileges to the monks of St. Catherine Monastery in Mt. Sinai. It consisted of several clauses covering all aspects of human rights including such topics as the protection of Christians, freedom of worship and movement, freedom to appoint their own judges and to own and maintain their property, exemption from military service, and the right to protection in war.

An English translation of that document is presented below.





This is a message from Muhammad ibn Abdullah, as a covenant to those who adopt Christianity, near and far, we are with them.
Verily I, the servants, the helpers, and my followers defend them, because Christians are my citizens; and by Allah! I hold out against anything that displeases them.
No compulsion is to be on them.
Neither are their judges to be removed from their jobs nor their monks from their monasteries.
No one is to destroy a house of their religion, to damage it, or to carry anything from it to the Muslims' houses.
Should anyone take any of these, he would spoil God's covenant and disobey His Prophet. Verily, they are my allies and have my secure charter against all that they hate.
No one is to force them to travel or to oblige them to fight.
The Muslims are to fight for them.
If a female Christian is married to a Muslim, it is not to take place without her approval. She is not to be prevented from visiting her church to pray.
Their churches are to be respected. They are neither to be prevented from repairing them nor the sacredness of their covenants.
No one of the nation (Muslims) is to disobey the covenant till the Last Day (end of the world).


This charter of privileges has been honored and faithfully applied by Muslims throughout the centuries in all lands they ruled. Click here for more information.




What Non-Muslims Say About Prophet Muhammad (pbuh)
Biography of Prophet Muhammad (s)
Prophet Muhammad (s) in Hindu Scriptures
The Last Prophet and Qur'an in Previously Revealed Scriptures
Prophet Muhammad (s) in Parsi Scriptures



Copyright © 1990, 1997 Dr. A. Zahoor and Dr. Z. Haq
All Rights Reserved


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